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 Post subject: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 7:46 am 
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I've had a go at creating a character sheet form using Adobe InDesign CS3 and Acrobat 8. At this stage it is a simple matter of filling in the form using Adobe reader, just like you would normally write your character sheet. Subsequent versions will have drop-down lists and so on to save some time and effort. It needs testing -- so please download it and have a go at using it. Feedback appreciated.

Regards,


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File comment: Version 1 of the PDF character sheet form.
Character Sheet - trosfans.pdf [743.13 KiB]
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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 8:12 am 
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Ill get on it right away.

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 3:56 pm 
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Thanks, Ian.

I was hoping that you'd upload your character sheet.


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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 6:11 pm 
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Page 9: I don't understand the need for Shock tracking bar. Shock comes and goes in an instant, so, why to track it? On the other hand, I've yet to see a sheet (aside from mine own, which I'm building) that would include a bar to mark the Health loss that occurs from BL. So, switch the "Shock" with "Health" -- Fatigue/Pain/BL/Health would be a sensible order of organisation, I think.

And one point more... Is Sorcery Pool necessary if the sheet doesn't include Sorcery attributes?

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 8:30 pm 
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I'm going to break the character sheet up into its separate areas. So there will be the cover sheet, the combat sheet, the sorcery sheet, the combat results sheets, and the running totals sheet.

The running totals sheet will be like the combat results sheets -- no fields to fill in, that's supposed to happen in-game. We use these as a kind of automated gaming notes for the character -- the running totals are there, the wounds and skill track, and also the event list. The event lists build up over time, giving the player a memory aid -- and allowing the referee to sew long-term plot arcs without fearing that players simply won't remember who certain characters were linked to in the past.

With the knowledge I have at the moment creating a PDF form is ridiculously cumbersome. So I will spend some time learning what I can about forms before the next version gets produced.

Please keep the comments coming. In particular if there are things you'd like to see on the Running Totals sheet, or what you'd like to see on the sorcery sheet let me know.

Regards,

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 10:14 pm 
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I have a tiny comment, and this is really a small, nit-picky detail that probably only I care about.

However, any chance you can change the order of the Attributes to reflect the order on the book's character sheet? I am so used to that order, that I see the attribute block as a 'picture' and automatically assume the top stat is strenght, the next agility, etc.

I am probably the only one who cares about this though.

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 10:21 pm 
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I like your structured organisation, Ian. I'm aiming to create a one-page sheet myself (I'm not sure it's possible even with my broader skills) but I had considered some things you might also benefit from:

a) More detail on the wounds. I woudnt make "BL etc" and "Wound location etc" to separate tables. Why not make it a cross reference? The Zone marking is a personal perefernece, but there should be "d6 result", "Blood Loss", "Pain", "Unmodified Pain" and "Healed" columns on on the same row in addition to what you have. "BL" and "Pain" columns would be used like your current ones, but now they would be directly linked to the wound for easy reference. "Unmodified Pain" is from what the healing is determined, so, it's important to mark down too. "Healed" would be a box to mark down the lowered TN by number or like scrapes ... you know, like days are marked without a calendar. "Unmodified Pain" would also ease the process of recalculating Pain again, should the wound open by chance. And I'd handle Health and Fatigue as extra rows beneath the Wounds.

b) I will definetly try to mark down attributes in the means of dots from habit. So, I wouldn't have Will Power 4, but Will Power **** (and 3 blank dots). While I don't urge you to follow the trend with attributes (that's a personal preference, and you'd have trouble marking down superhumans) I think marking down SAs and Drama would benefit from it greatly, as they're capped equally for everybody. You would have to use the eraser only if you're spending Drama/SAs, not when you're earning them.

c) Concider removing the boxes around swinging zones to make the distinction more clear. Click here to see the difference (didn't know how adding an attchment goes here). The zone VI and VII are definetly more problematic...

Well... that's it from now. :)

stuh42l wrote:
I am probably the only one who cares about this though.

Oh gosh! I always wondered why Strength was the Guillaume de Morillon's lowest Physical attribute considering his picture. :?

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 11:29 pm 
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Oh my! Look what happens when a forum is actively moderated! Accidental double posts are like they never happened... :geek:

The form building is flowing better now. Create the form in InDesign, export as a PDF into Acrobat, detect the fields in Acrobat and save the form, open the form in LiveCycle Designer and build the code behind the fields. LiveCycle also exports to HTML -- which means, with a bit of luck, we'll have a character creation web page soon...

Regards,

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2008 11:34 pm 
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stuh42l wrote:
... any chance you can change the order of the Attributes to reflect the order on the book's character sheet ...?


This one's a no. It is easier for newbs if the order is alphabetical. I understand that's painful for the old hands...

Regards,

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 1:53 am 
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The sheet looks great!

My 2 cents on the order of attributes: In a list of only five items, I'd be surprised if alphabetization saves anyone more than half a second of lookup time.

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 2:12 am 
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Daeruin wrote:
In a list of only five items, I'd be surprised if alphabetization saves anyone more than half a second of lookup time. Just my 2 cents there.


In my experience that's not how it works with a newb, particularly someone for whom the story is important and the character sheet is simply baffling. Instead of one item amongst five, it's finding one item amidst six pages of typological confusion:

Quote:
Referee: "OK, what's your Soc?"
New Player: "My sock?" Rustles through character sheets. "Nope, no socks on my character. I do have boots though, so I guess I should have socks. Or stockings."
Referee: "No, no, not on you equipment page. Soc -- it's a stat."
New Player: Looking through skills "No, I still don't have a Soc. Does a warrior have a Soc?"
Old Player: "Yeah, a really crappy one 'cos all your points went into TO..." Laughs.
New Player: "My points went into my toe?"
Referee: Looks at Old Player "Don't confuse things!"
Old Player: Feigning Hurt. "It wasn't deliberate!" Leans towards new player. "Soc -- front page, left side, under attributes."
New Player: "... still can't see it ..."
Referee: "Below Mental Aptitude and above Perception..."
Old Player: "Ah, the irony..."
Referee: "Shut up!"
New Player: "Got it. 3. Heh, why aren't these things in alphabetical order? They'd be much easier to find..."


:)

I play with a group with members who seldom look at their character sheets. The character sheet is an impediment to the flow of the story, a source of confusion, and the destroyer of scene continuity. If something makes a character sheet 1% easier to use -- I'm there.

Regards,

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 6:21 am 
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Ian.Plumb wrote:
If something makes a character sheet 1% easier to use -- I'm there.

The very reason I'm obsessed with a single page character sheet -- not even having to turn one's single page has proven to be most effective so far.

Any comments on my suggestions by the way?

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 7:00 am 
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Hi,

higgins wrote:
a) More detail on the wounds. I woudnt make "BL etc" and "Wound location etc" to separate tables. Why not make it a cross reference? The Zone marking is a personal perefernece, but there should be "d6 result", "Blood Loss", "Pain", "Unmodified Pain" and "Healed" columns on on the same row in addition to what you have. "BL" and "Pain" columns would be used like your current ones, but now they would be directly linked to the wound for easy reference. "Unmodified Pain" is from what the healing is determined, so, it's important to mark down too. "Healed" would be a box to mark down the lowered TN by number or like scrapes ... you know, like days are marked without a calendar. "Unmodified Pain" would also ease the process of recalculating Pain again, should the wound open by chance. And I'd handle Health and Fatigue as extra rows beneath the Wounds.


Spoken like a true health care professional. There isn't a lot of room there though.

higgins wrote:
b) I will definetly try to mark down attributes in the means of dots from habit. So, I wouldn't have Will Power 4, but Will Power **** (and 3 blank dots). While I don't urge you to follow the trend with attributes (that's a personal preference, and you'd have trouble marking down superhumans) I think marking down SAs and Drama would benefit from it greatly, as they're capped equally for everybody. You would have to use the eraser only if you're spending Drama/SAs, not when you're earning them.


It makes sense to have the SAs on the running totals page as they are dynamic. My prefernce is to list the SA on the front page and list the SA and its value on the running totals page. Using check boxes on the running totals page for tracking SA values is a good idea.

higgins wrote:
c) Concider removing the boxes around swinging zones to make the distinction more clear. Click here to see the difference (didn't know how adding an attchment goes here). The zone VI and VII are definetly more problematic...


My own preference here is to have separate images for cut and thrust, and place them on the back of the running totals sheet. That would give room for three fully developed proficiencies on the combat sheet.

I'll get the basic character sheet completed and working and then I'll look at variations.

Regards,

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 9:17 am 
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Ian.Plumb wrote:
higgins wrote:
a) More detail on the wounds. /--/

Spoken like a true health care professional. There isn't a lot of room there though.

What do you mean? It wouldn't take much more than it takes now... I tried it with my Paint skills. ;)

Otherwise we could just skip the "unmodified" column and write 9-WP or whatever it says on the chart, but that would make counting the total effective pain difficult, while just marking down the effective pain would make you go through the tables when making healing rolls. Edit: Of course, the solution might be something like this.

Ian.Plumb wrote:
My own preference here is to have separate images for cut and thrust, and place them on the back of the running totals sheet. That would give room for three fully developed proficiencies on the combat sheet.

Hmm... Wouldn't that be more confusing? Going by your New Player dialogue style: "Who's this other guy?" :lol: Anyways, I witheld any further comments until I've actually seen the twins. :)

But what's the "draw weight" under missile weapons? I dont recall such a thing...

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 Post subject: Re: A TRoS Core Character Sheet for trosfans.com
PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2008 9:45 am 
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Here is the new version of the Character Page. It has:

1) A reasonable tab order between fields.
2) If you click on the decorative frame you can load your own character portrait. Keep in mind it is a simple load -- you'll have to size the image in Photoshop or whatever before you load it.
3) All the Core skill packets are listed in the Skill Packet drop downs. It is also a free-text field so you can enter your own packet.
4) All The Companion Social Packets are listed in the Social Packet drop down. It is also a free-text field so you can enter your own packet.
5) All the Core skills are listed in the Skill drop-down. It is also a free-text field so you can enter your own skills. There are 20 skill fields available. No, it doesn't auto-populate skills based on Packet selection.
6) The Derived Attributes are auto-calculated but can be over-ridden.

All feedback appreciated.

It won't take long to complete the Combat Sheet and the Running Totals sheet changes. Next weekend.

Regards,


Attachments:
Character Page - Form 0.1.pdf [252.94 KiB]
Downloaded 262 times

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