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 Post subject: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2009 5:46 pm 
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Just out of idle curiosity, what is your own personal roleplaying history before coming to TRoS? In rough chronological order, and without the homebrews, mine would be:

German system, D&D, AD&D, another German system, MERP, Rolemaster, Spacemaster, Stormbringer (Runequest permutation), Call of Cthulhu, Runequest, Pendragon, Ars Magica, Cyberpunk 2020, Vampire, Mage, Kult, Warhammer FRP, Talislanta, GURPS, Amber Diceless, Fading Suns, Over the Edge, Harnmaster, Castle Falkenstein, Gemini.

Systems I’ve played heavily would be AD&D, Ars Magica, Vampire, GURPS and Harnmaster.

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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2009 7:03 pm 
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Fun Topic.

To the best of my memory, leading up to TROS I'd played in campaigns of (in chronological order):

AD&D2E, MERP (ICE), Marvel Superheroes, ElfQuest RPG, Warhammer FRP, Shadowrun 2E, Vampire: TM, GURPS (about 8 zillion varieties here), Werewolf: TA, Star Wars (WEG), Deadlands, Dzikie Pola, and Pendragon.

I'm sure there's a few more in there, but clearly they weren't that memorable.

The majority of play up until I was 19 was AD&D and GURPS, with Warhammer usually running all summer. After I was about 20 (about the time they announced DnD 3.0) it was pretty much exclusively Pendragon with some WHFRP and WEG SW thrown in. That was the time period that made me want to write TROS, combined with the realization that the fiction I wanted to create and the fights I wanted to get in weren't possible in any of the games I was playing.

Also note the complete lack of Forge or "Indie" games in here. I discovered all of that stuff *after* I published TROS (indeed, because of it). I think it's part of the reason Ron Edwards latched onto me so quick--I'd discovered all of this GNS stuff in a vacuum and hadn't even realized it.

Jake

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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2009 8:30 pm 
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Well, I don't know about "before" because I've only had one chance to play TRoS in tabletop and that was running the introductory scenario from the Companion as a one off at my university's gaming society after the year long campaigns were all finished. Other systems that I've played include Star Wars d20 Revised and Saga (I preferred Revised), Call of Cthulhu, Elric, nWoD Mortal, oWoD Mage and Pendragon; the last four being one off games and the WoD games were played as part of a role playing competition.


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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2009 9:51 pm 
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My first ever was D&D 3e. Then we expanded it by Grim-n-Gritty add-on rules, to make the system more realistic. Some point after that, I joined a Vampire: the Masquerade game, but it was short lived and success mechanic was quite confusing and I never really got the hang of it at that point. We continued building Grim-n-Gritty rules to more complex and clunky. Star Wars d20, Stargate d20. A WEG d6 based Ravenloft game. Some Paranoia, but only as a player (meaning it was against the rules that I know any of the rules). I think then was the point when nWoD came out and I kicked D&D for good... and started a new game using nWoD system... which I just refereed an hour or so ago, meaning it's still running. :) Add some Vampire: the Requiem and Werewolf: the Forsaken there as well. Now just every adding mechanic sounds odd to me. There's got to be successes! :)

Oh yeah, and one short game was based on Warhammer... and no, I don't mean Warhammer FRPG... just.. plain ol' Warhammer miniature rules. Damn, that was unforgiving combat...

Since my game has been so long running, I haven't really touched other systems that have ticked my interest (Silhouette, Over the Edge, Heaven & Earth, Unhallowed Metropolis) ... and I also own some of the RPGs I'll probably never play, such as Chi-Chian and Human Occupied Landfill.

Do any of you play boardgames as well, btw? :)

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Last edited by higgins on Thu Jun 09, 2011 8:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 2:04 am 
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Well I can say this much atleast, I haven't "been around the block" as much as some of you guys.

My gaming life started at around 12 with AD&D, we really didn't know the rules to begin with, for instace we thought you got 1dX Hitpoints at first level then an extra 2dX at second, then 3dX at third, ah I still remember trouncing around with over 800hp smashing giants and gods, lol. Then other people started to GM and we learnt the rules, I don't know if the game got more or less fun from there. During AD&D we tried our hand at some GAMMA as well, but that was mainly other peoples homebrew stuff.

From AD&D we started playing 3.0 and then 3.5, we also ran a few months of extremely fun Vampire: TM (I don't know why that ended), we played revised Star Wars which was also fun, I mean who doesn't want to be a Jedi atleast once in their lives? Who!!!

I discovered TRoS ages ago but only really convinced my group to start playing last year, since then its like a great big weight has been lifted, TRoS more or less is everything I was looking for in an RPG.

And so here we are.

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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 2:06 am 
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Hey Higgins, I used to play Warhammer Battle, Heroquest, Warhammer Quest, Space Quest, Space Crusade, and others but have since stopped.

The final blow was when I got into Warhammer, and just couldn't afford to buy an armie, buh-buy minatures I will always miss you!

Cheers & God Bless!

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"It was hard-fought, a desperate affair that could have gone badly; if God had not helped me, the outcome would have been quick and fatal" (115) ~ Beowulf after defeating Grendle's Mother.


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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 7:26 am 
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Hehe... We never had any miniatures either. Just the core rulebook. :P

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- Lord Petyr Baelish, A Game of Thrones


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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 7:44 am 
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Board games. Hmm, let's see.

I used to play Blood Bowl and Space Hulk, and a cumbersome but excellent historical strategy game called Republic of Rome. Nowadays I play a game of Robo Ralley from time to time. And a lot of Backgammon.

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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 4:51 pm 
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First tried DnD at around age 12 or 13 in summer camp. Played the Basic Set and then AD&D in high school. LOVED IT!!! By about 10th Grade we were playing our own home-made post-apocalypse game with a very realisitc combat system. Had a lot of fun with that. We called it "Aftermath" but then we found out another game also called Aftermath had been invented by somebody else which ended the pipe (bong?) dreams of doing anything commercially with the system we made up.

Around this time we also played Paranoia, Traveller and Call of Cthulhu all three of which I liked a lot, Boot Hill (nice idea but not well executed), and tried Gamma World (hated it), some kind of superhero games (not my cup of tea), and Runequest which I thought was so-so (too much of an "SCA" vibe for me). We also used to play wargames like Squad Leader, Panzer Blitz, and all those Steve Jackson games like Car Wars (which I really loved) Bolo and etc. We used to tinker with rules a lot then, mixing and matching things (like using Car Wars rules in our post-apocalypse RPG)

Played DnD in the Army a couple of times, once memorably in AIT but was mostly turned off by the "Gamist" way those people played, I think that was AD&D. We also played Twilight 2000 a few times which was perfect for being in the Army in Germany during the height of the Cold War. That was a lot of fun, mostly played with non-gamers. Some great drunken nights.

Once I got out of the army, I occasionally tried some homebrew DnD games which were usually a lot of fun. It was rare that we had time or stability for that though. We used to play the naval wargame Harpoon (a good simulation but not a very balanced game). I also made a WW II fighter combat game around this time when I was going to University of New Orleans, I was homelss at that time and was spending a lot of time hanging out in Libraries to soak up the Air Conditioning, I did a ton of research on WW II aircraft. I wish I still had that game, now that I play Il2 1946 flight Sim I can see how realistic it was.

Later as things got more stable for me, I used to play a lot of wargames at Advanced Squad leader, Axis and Allies, Panzer Leader, Third Reich, Midway, PanzerGruppe Guderian, several others I can't remember. Diplomacy. I tried GURPs then but didn't really like the combat system.

In the mid 90s I moved to California, and I kind of quit playing RPGs for a while then because I didn't know anyone who played them. I got a good job finally and bought all the Advanced Squad Leader books I had never been able to afford, but didn't know anyone who played games any more.

After moving back to New Orleans around 1998 I first started getting into HEMA and didn't do much RPG stuff. Someone also iintroduced me to some cool indy games at that time which we played occasionally, Credo (a board game simulating the Council of Nicea) Tribes (a really interesting game invented by anthropologists where you play a Stone Age tribesman (or woman) and try to reproduce as many offspring as possible. Great flirting game to play with a lot of girls around :) ) We also played a few games of Illuminatus! and Dune. But I didn't play RPGs for several years.

Then around 2002 or 2003 I got wind of a company in England doing a game based on one of my favorite authors Jack Vance (Dying Earth RPG). I contacted them and sold them on the idea of doing a DnD book for their game using the D20 license (which became the Primer of Practical magic). Around then I tried a couple of DnD 3.0 games as a player and was horrified to find out how "Gameist" everyone played. The whole open feeling, the immersion, the use of imagination seemed to be gone, replaced by a wierd adversarial treasure accumulation process, sort of an ego stroking conveyor belt. When the Primer was released I learned how much the culture of DnD had really changed and how much I didn't relate to it any more. It seemed to be taken over by what I thought of as "Klingons" I wanted to change it to open it up back for people who used to play the way I did, I thought the game should be accessible to regular people not just the kind of wierd guys that hang around in hobby shops.

Around 2003? I found out about TROS and wanted to get involved, met Jake online, and that dovetailed with my interest in HEMA. In 2004 I hosted an event for ARMA and met Jake in person, we settled a famous bet we made on The Forge to do with weapon reach in a fun little contest.

Meeting Jake at the ARMA event led to starting work on the weapons encyclopedia for The Flower of Battle, which ended up a much bigger job than I anticipated (especially getting all the drawings finished with my buddy Ramon who was a tatoo artist at the time working in Florida) During this period I also tried out Shadowrun a few times which I thought was interesting, I liked how their dice pool worked.

Meanwhile I found the Forge culture really lively, already quite matured by the time i ran into it. Some of the games that came out of there (esp. Burning Wheel) looked really cool (never played it yet). But I didn't really agree with GNS theory at all, it didn't fit with how I liked to play or the kind of game I wanted to see, I thought it was too restrictive of a dogma and I got into a big argument on there about my ideas of how to revive realism and historical grounding in RPGs....

Which is what led ultimately to "Roll many / Keep one" Martial Pool dice system for combat (kind of a mutant offspring of a standard Dice-pool and D20) and eventually the Codex, which I'm real happy with. But it is just a combat system and it kind of needs a home. Right now I'd like to see some kind of nexus for people who like an "old school" way of playing RPGs outside of the Corporate structure of HASBRO / DnD or the small press games (Gurps, White Wolf etc.) or the Indy Forge world. I'd like to see something done with the open source potential of the OGL license, a new "DnD for grownups". I think there is a niche for the big generic fantasy RPG that people can tinker with and use for a launching off point to (or safe haven from) other more specific Indy and small-press systems. Something modular and flexible, and truly simple at it's core.

To date I've still only ever had a few short TROS games, mainly run by Clinton Nixon. I hope next time Jake comes down here he can run one for us.

S.

EDIT: I recently learned about WHFRPG, I like it a lot (even the new edition) it sounds like I really missed out on that one, I wish I'd have known about it back in the day....


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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 9:06 pm 
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Grettir wrote:
Republic of Rome
Ah, I've always wanted to try that one, but nobody in our gameboard circle owns it. I personally love A Game of Thrones Boardgame and Arkham Horror was quite fun. My greatest achievement in boardgaming is that I managed to addict a friend of mine, who now owns 60+ boardgames of all sorts. :ugeek: Too bad he lives far away now.

My favourite "boardgame" is a card game really. IGOR: The Mad Scientist's Lament -- an excellent and quite quick domino-like card game with very funny and very thematic mad science humour. :twisted:

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"Brothels are a much sounder investment than ships, I've found. Whores seldom sink, and when they are boarded by pirates, why, the pirates pay good coin like everyone else."
- Lord Petyr Baelish, A Game of Thrones


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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 1:52 am 
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I started with MERP when I was 11, then branched out into Rolemaster. I continue to play both of those games every now and then because I love the Middle Earth setting and they're so easy for me to play, having memorized most of the rules (core, at least). I've played Marvel Superheroes, a couple incarnations of Star Wars, the Wheel of Time RPG, the Game of Thrones RPG, but never completed a campaign in any of those. I played DnD one time. :)

I play board games sometimes, too. One of my buddies is a board game fanatic. He must own well over a hundred. I enjoy the Lord of the Rings board game, Settlers of Catan, Twilight of the Republic, Shadows Over Camelot, and various others. But my favorite of all time is the Game of Thrones board game. That game totally rocks! It has one of the coolest mechanics of all time.

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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 3:55 am 
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Sasquatch wrote:
I also made a WW II fighter combat game around this time when I was going to University of New Orleans, I was homelss at that time and was spending a lot of time hanging out in Libraries to soak up the Air Conditioning, I did a ton of research on WW II aircraft. I wish I still had that game, now that I play Il2 1946 flight Sim I can see how realistic it was.


You wish you still had it? Man I would give my left arm for a game like that!
What happened to it?

Cheers1

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"It was hard-fought, a desperate affair that could have gone badly; if God had not helped me, the outcome would have been quick and fatal" (115) ~ Beowulf after defeating Grendle's Mother.


Last edited by Crow Caller on Fri Feb 27, 2009 3:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 3:50 pm 
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Daeruin wrote:
But my favorite of all time is the Game of Thrones board game. That game totally rocks! It has one of the coolest mechanics of all time.
Can't agree more. I completely forgot about Catan. An excellent game. Alhambra is nice too. :)

The only flaw in AGOT board game is that it's more fun with more people, but it's hard to get the full 5-6 where I live.

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"Brothels are a much sounder investment than ships, I've found. Whores seldom sink, and when they are boarded by pirates, why, the pirates pay good coin like everyone else."
- Lord Petyr Baelish, A Game of Thrones


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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 4:27 pm 
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My problem with board games is i can never get up to speed with them on my own. I need someone to show me how to play it, particularly if it's fairly complex. Part of this is sort of a morale issue. Everyone seems to know someone who is "The Board Game Guy" (or Gal), the person who actually likes pouring over board game rules the way I like to pour over RPG rules, and who has the enthusiasm to gloss over or sidestep any 'broken' issues and keep up the momentum for those all important first games, and keep everyone convinced it is going to work until they actually start playing and it does.

It is at this critical juncture i often fail to rise to the occasion. I bought a copy of Arkham Horror, for example, which looks like a lot of fun. But we tried to set it up three times, all three times we got kind of drunk by the time we finally had it all set up and it didn't really click when we tried to start playing so we just gave up. I had a copy of one of those Cattan games too, maybe not the right one I'm not sure if it was the original game or a spinoff... but after making a fairly 'game' effort to read the rules I really didn't get it. It would be different if I had a lot of friends around who played games of this type, considering pretty much everyone I'm likely to play a board game with has no experience of anything more avante gaurde than monopoly I really have to have it down.

I have a gamer buddy like that but he recently had his second kid, so it puts a crimp in my board game life. Which is a drag because I think sometimes there is really nothing better than a good board game of this type with a few good friends.

(one of the things I liked about those old Steve Jackson minibox games back in the 80's was that they were so easy to figure out and start playing real quickly...)

S.


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 Post subject: Re: What RPGs did you play before TRoS?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 5:27 pm 
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higgins wrote:
Grettir wrote:
Republic of Rome
Ah, I've always wanted to try that one, ....

Well, … Republic of Rome.

The rules take several hours to read, several games to learn, and several lifetimes to master. But it’s a very nice game where every player controls a senate faction and tries to become sole master of Rome, either by accumulating enough political power in the senate or else by having enough legions under his senators’ direct command to be able to stage a coup. There’s a lot of shady deals and backstabbing going on among the players, all of the I-scratch-your-back-you’ll-scratch-mine-type.

The beauty of the game is that about half the time, all the players lose, as their tight-fisted politicking brings the Roman state to the brink of collapse and then pushes it over. Rome goes down the drain, and everybody loses. Beautiful.

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