It is currently Wed Jan 16, 2019 11:24 pm

All times are UTC




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: EoS: CP & MP
PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 11:08 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:05 pm
Posts: 2035
Location: Estonia
Do we need a distinction between CP & MP?

Sure, these pools will be used differently a bit, but that depends on the weapon, rather than the proficiency, right?

I mean, if I can throw the knife with my CP, can I stab with it using my MP?

Point is, sometimes the distinctions feels like splitting hairs.

_________________
"Brothels are a much sounder investment than ships, I've found. Whores seldom sink, and when they are boarded by pirates, why, the pirates pay good coin like everyone else."
- Lord Petyr Baelish, A Game of Thrones


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: EoS: CP & MP
PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 3:06 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 4:39 am
Posts: 346
Location: Orange County, California
Combat Pool & Missile Pool = (Agility + Wits) + Weapon Proficiency, right? So it is assembled the same.

Difference: Refreshing. Combat Pools (Melee) refresh every two exchanges, but Missile Pools refresh every turn/limelight.

Difference: Terrain Rolls. In Melee it's used for Terrain Rolls, for Archery, it's yet unknown.

_________________
"Remember it well, then... this night, this great victory. So that in the years ahead, you can say, 'I was there that night, with Arthur, the King!' . . . For it is the doom of men that they forget."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: EoS: CP & MP
PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 3:22 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:05 pm
Posts: 2035
Location: Estonia
There are bound to be some terrain rolls for archery... if not for anything else, then for moving between range bands.

Refreshing is a good point though, but is that tied to the type of pool? If the a guy with a double crossbow is pulled into melee and he wants to pull off the shots, will he really get only one refresh per limelight while the melee combatant gets multiple refreshes?

_________________
"Brothels are a much sounder investment than ships, I've found. Whores seldom sink, and when they are boarded by pirates, why, the pirates pay good coin like everyone else."
- Lord Petyr Baelish, A Game of Thrones


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: EoS: CP & MP
PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:38 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 4:39 am
Posts: 346
Location: Orange County, California
higgins wrote:
...but is that tied to the type of pool? If the a guy with a double crossbow is pulled into melee and he wants to pull off the shots, will he really get only one refresh per limelight while the melee combatant gets multiple refreshes?


Good question. That would mean...

1. Archer (PC) is shooting at Target (NPC) outside of melee. This is handled at the limelight level. Target is evading using Attribute + Attribute/Dodging Skill spec. The limelight effectually ends when Archer is out of MP ("Is he going to get away? You have one limelight - that is, one MP - to stop him!")

2. Archer (PC) is shooting at Target (NPC), who is engaged in melee with Swordman (PC). This is handled at the refresh level. Target is evading with Combat Pool. Archer gets multiple refreshes each limelight?

So...does this seem right to you?

_________________
"Remember it well, then... this night, this great victory. So that in the years ahead, you can say, 'I was there that night, with Arthur, the King!' . . . For it is the doom of men that they forget."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: EoS: CP & MP
PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 9:46 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:05 pm
Posts: 2035
Location: Estonia
I think the solution is:

1. use the passive defense

2. use the active defense (and archer doesn't get new refreshes)

In other words, situation decides the active/passive use, not the player. For NPCs anyway.

_________________
"Brothels are a much sounder investment than ships, I've found. Whores seldom sink, and when they are boarded by pirates, why, the pirates pay good coin like everyone else."
- Lord Petyr Baelish, A Game of Thrones


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: EoS: CP & MP
PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 2:35 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 4:39 am
Posts: 346
Location: Orange County, California
higgins wrote:
In other words, situation decides the active/passive use, not the player. For NPCs anyway.


OK, that makes sense, but what are the benchmark situations? In example one the Target (NPC) is aware he's being targeted by Archer (PC). Why only passive defense?

Passive Defense: Add Difficulty to Timing Roll.
Active Defense: Target uses CP or Agility+Wits (?) to evade at TN4, 7, or 9. Target has option of forfeiting Active for Passive Defense.

Archer is firing on:
...an unaware target not engaged in combat. Use Passive
...an aware target not engaged in combat. Use Active
...an unaware target engaged in combat. Use Passive
...an aware target engaged in combat. Use Active

I would like to see Passive Defenses be somehow unified throughout the rules of the game - whether that's not getting hit by an arrow, not being convinced by diplomacy (for NPCs), not being mind-warped by magic, etc. If we decide to say Passive Defense is an additional success required on a roll, is that going to be viable through the game?

_________________
"Remember it well, then... this night, this great victory. So that in the years ahead, you can say, 'I was there that night, with Arthur, the King!' . . . For it is the doom of men that they forget."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: EoS: CP & MP
PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 7:51 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:43 pm
Posts: 2112
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Seanachai wrote:
I would like to see Passive Defenses be somehow unified throughout the rules of the game - whether that's not getting hit by an arrow, not being convinced by diplomacy (for NPCs), not being mind-warped by magic, etc. If we decide to say Passive Defense is an additional success required on a roll, is that going to be viable through the game?


This is the reason to allow a roll for passive defense by the target -- it unifies the mechanic with what is bound to be used in the sorcery section. I can't imagine the players being happy with a system where the NPC sorcerer can hit their character with a spell and they don't get any kind of roll.

That having been said, a unified mechanic isn't everything. If three archers are targeting the PC do they get three passive defense rolls? Does every NPC the players target get a defensive roll? It would be a quicker resolution if there was simply a penalty on the shot rather than an opposed roll.

Regards,

_________________
Ian Plumb
Illustrations for Gamers
Lyonpaedia
Griffin Grove Gaming
Kraftworks for Kids School Holiday Program


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: EoS: CP & MP
PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 9:58 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2008 10:05 pm
Posts: 2035
Location: Estonia
This gets complicated. I mean, it would make sense that the aware Evasion versus the archer's bolt wasn't "free" ... in other words, it should come from the CP.

Blargh, this isn't half the way done I thought it was.

_________________
"Brothels are a much sounder investment than ships, I've found. Whores seldom sink, and when they are boarded by pirates, why, the pirates pay good coin like everyone else."
- Lord Petyr Baelish, A Game of Thrones


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: EoS: CP & MP
PostPosted: Wed Feb 23, 2011 4:46 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Aug 11, 2009 4:39 am
Posts: 346
Location: Orange County, California
higgins wrote:
Blargh, this isn't half the way done I thought it was.


Don't get frustrated! We are making AWESOME progress.

Here's what we know:

Whether it's the realm of ranged combat, social persuasion, or dark sorcery, we are always going to have two things:
    Agents (those attempting to do something to others) and
    Patients (the objects of the mundane, social, or magical violence).

    We know that Agents are going to make a roll.
    We know that something makes some Patients more difficult to affect (eg. higher "reflexes", Willpower, etc).
    We are unsure whether Patients should always make a roll.

Options:

    A. An Agent's roll is modified by the Patient. This could mean a dice penalty (see nWOD).
    B. An Agent's difficulty is modified by the Patient.
    B1. The TN number might be the Patient's relevant attribute.
    B2. The Difficulty is increased by 1-3 because of Patient.
    C. Agent and Patient always roll against each other.


If we choose C then that begs the question of how to frame the difficulty for the Patient and where he gets his dice from. When TNs where dynamic the Patient's difficulty was based on Agent or circumstances (TN to resist magic was Agent's ART score).

_________________
"Remember it well, then... this night, this great victory. So that in the years ahead, you can say, 'I was there that night, with Arthur, the King!' . . . For it is the doom of men that they forget."


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 9 posts ] 

All times are UTC


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron


Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group              Designed by QuakeZone